Edition: U.S. | Arabic | Set Pref
May 13, 2008
Posted: 831 GMT

LONDON, England – “Mumbai, Shanghai, Dubai or … bye bye” — this is the rather dark joke that’s been doing the rounds in London’s financial community recently.

The gist is that unless you work in emerging markets, prepare to lose your job.

Europe’s biggest bank, HSBC, illustrated the trend this week when it revealed huge losses in America, but big profits in Asia.

There just isn’t the money to be made in Western markets that there once was, so the banks are cutting back dramaticially on their headcount.

Bankers rarely get sympathy when there are job cuts because they are generally paid very well for what many see as straightforward gambling. But this time round they are getting even less sympathy.

In fact, they are being blamed for being the architects of their own downfall and for dragging the rest of us down with them. Critics say the industry should be taught a lesson.

What that lesson should be will be considered today by a group of European finance ministers called Eurogroup.

According to El Pais, the meeting will consider whether the Anglo-Saxon market model is a danger to global financial stability and whether firms chased immediate profits at the cost of massive sackings.

Has the short-term pay structure of modern capitalism become deformed, causing firms to take on excessive risk without regard to stakeholders or society?

In other words, should bankers be punished for causing the credit crisis by having their performance bonuses slashed — by law?

Britain’s Daily Telegraph has its view: “Bankers’ pay may be excessive and geared too much toward risk-taking but it is not the job of government to regulate it, it is the job of shareholders who have lost billions in the credit crisis to insist on new rules if they want them.”

What do you think? Post a response here on this blog.

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Peter Kramer   May 13th, 2008 952 GMT

Partly because interest rates went down, inflation went up, and my money is getting worth less. The low interest rates help the big banks. In other words, I am currently paying to help out the big banks. Now, would you not say that, since I am paying, I should be allow to have some sort of minimal say in what is happening with MY money?

Maria Giovanna Villari   May 13th, 2008 1007 GMT

Todd,
here is my comment.
“Anglo-Saxon” market it still an example, that’s my opinion. And who taught Shanghai, Bombay an the others to deal in world economy?
Theme, the english merchants.
Now, what Asia learned from that, is the problem.
Not only beeing part of the business, but making it going up and down.
Would you say once that is not George Bush or Alan Greespan the puppet makers?
I would!
Maria Giovanna

philip Mathews   May 14th, 2008 824 GMT

i like that - the english merchants taught the asians to trade.

F. Huber   May 15th, 2008 2023 GMT

The differences between the Neo-Liberal (Hayek) economic model (USA/UK) and the Social Market Economy model in Germany (a free market economy but with a strong social bias as far as the distribution of wealth is concerned) which dates from 1947, is becoming more and more apparent every day.

Top executives receiving € millions (in double digits) salaries create considerable animosity in Germany, where there is now a proposal that only the first million of a salary can be set off before tax, and any further amount must come out of after-tax profits. Furthermore, a golden goodbye to top execs who lose their jobs because of losses incurred at the company where they were in charge, meets with incredulity. Marcel Ospel’s pay cheque when he residned from UBS last month was allegedly (in the media) just his basic salary due of an estimated CHF2 million.

There are strong feelings in Germany about the subprime crash; in
an interview in this week’s “Stern” magazine, Germany’s president Horst Köhler (formerly chief at the IMF) said that the bankers had created “a monster”, by using uncontrolled leverage and he called for a “clear and audible confession of guilt” from banks. He wants all the German “Landesbanken”to merge into a central “savings” bank.

Interestingly I read an article by the Chief Economist at BNP Paribas (Philippe ?? I forget his surname, he is also a Professor at a Paris University) in the Swiss financial paper “Finanz und Wirtschaft”
some weeks ago in which he stated that many tranches of the lowest qualty, riskiest mortgage debt which were securitized, were rated AAA , although they were the securities which were designed to bear the first LOSSES!! Many people were not aware of this fact, wrote the BNP economist. In other words, it was quite possible that anyone buying mortgage-backed securities with a triple AAA rating, believing they were best quality paper, might in fact be buying the riskiest, the most toxic debt.

The German government is said to be taking steps for much closer observation of the banks. There is a German saying “Vertrauen ist gut, Kontrolle ist besser” (Trust is good , but control is better). It looks like there is going to be far less trust in future, imo, and a lot more control and supervision of banks operating in Germany.

Graham   May 19th, 2008 857 GMT

Concerning high wages for bankers: it is the shareholders’ equity that supports the firm and it is their profits to divide up. Somehow the executives have gotten the upper hand and have convinced the representatives of the shareholders (i.e the Board) that they can’t be replaced. Believe me, these guys are smart but they are not worth the high wages being paid them! Time to get back in tune with reality and reward those who are taking the real risks - the shareholders! Look at the SocGen trading scam…those guys were asleep and more concerned with the upcoming lunch menu than trying to protect shareholders. The tide will turn (hopefully) and the rich bankers will be living like the rest of us and enjoying public transit.

Kurt   May 20th, 2008 2148 GMT

Hi Max,
In the world today, we see the growing concern about people and their actions. We see a fat person and say to each other, there should be a law to stop that so I do not have to pay for it later. Or the smoker, who’s actions are now viewed as to much added expense to us all. We put up camera’s in our cities, decided to listen to everyone’s phone calls, view our employees e-mails, and test them randomly for drugs, all under the term of weeding out the bad from the good. Yet we fail to control people with money. Why is that?

Why is it that it is the people with the money can influence the creation of our laws. Why is it that people with money can seem to do what they want without repercussions? They can lie to us to get us to invest our hard earn money into their ideas, then cheat us while walking away with the money we gave them, and the only thing that is said is, too bad.

Does it cost too much to enforce the law on the rich with their expensive lawyers who know how to twist the law, the law the lawyers help to write? Is there too few who can handle a multi-billion dollar company so too many in jail would bring a shortage of CEO’s in our world?

Maybe it is because when we see the so called brightest minds who get paid millions of dollars to run our world mess up, we realize who else is there and just accept the fact there was no one better.

I cannot help but feeling who is the worest of the bunch, the stupid man who has had little school, few breaks, living hand to mouth everyday, who finally gives into stealing to try to get ahead, or the man who has had it all. The education, the so called easy life, who cannot forcus on anything else but getting more, and is willing to cause the loss to the hard working people of the world to get there. Hard call for me to decided.

They say we need the rich, for it is they who have the money and the talent for progress. Okay, then I thank them. But for those who create hardship for thousands and thousands of people because their idea’s to make themselves more money fail, then I say, maybe you would be more careful with your decisions, if the only one who pays the price for a mistake, is the one who makes it. We all have to face that in our common lives, maybe it is time the rich have to face that too.

PaSh   May 21st, 2008 2238 GMT

All you bankers needed a break from playing and enjoying other peoples money……so move over and get on welfare…or find a new career……you can certainly take up some history lessons: ” The English taught the Asians to trade”………was that before or after the English used trade missions to rob the world???
Well atleast you can get back to doing some honest business in the banking industry….we all need second chances to correct our corruptness…….here’s yours. Good Luck!

Chiranjeev   May 22nd, 2008 737 GMT

HSBC or you name any, are no NGO’s. Its mere presence means target and profit. High Inflation, ever decreasing interest rates and low spending patterns are making life hard for these organisations to survive, so it’s not by fortune but by necessity that they are looking towards emerging markets be it China or India. These emerging markets are more of pilot projects for these financial bigges, the rules are always created and nurtured in the Anglo-Saxon market/model. It’s just that the rules of survival are implemented in these upcoming market.

Huge loss in America and big profit in Asia (That’s Wrong!)– No market is ever saturated. Remember business never serves a market, it creates it. No market is same, you cannot have a general rule of business for all markets. It’s just that you have to tweak the rules of the game. Yes in this world of ever decreasing lead time where dynamics are changing fast, everything boils down to one thing “how and who control’s the environment” everything else is a gain or a loss.

Pradeep Kumar Salwan   May 24th, 2008 1107 GMT

No one taught asians how to trade. Asians have learnt the way the Europeans trade.

Howard   May 25th, 2008 549 GMT

Just a small comment - HSBC, Europe’s biggest bank. Those of us old enough to remember will recall that HSBC stands for Hong Kong and Shanghai Banking Corporation. In focusing more on SE Asia and India, HSBC are simply returning to their origins, where the bank was started and mostly built for many, many, years. They were headquartered in Hong Kong for far longer than they have been in London.

peterjcooper   May 28th, 2008 429 GMT

Todd, At least bankers who choose to head to Dubai can participate in a monumental property boom. And with the local currency pegged to the US dollar interest rates are so low that the boom is being fanned out of control. Consider this, we have buyers queuing up in 40C to buy homes: http://arabianmoney.net/2008/05/28/buyers-queuing-overnight-as-demand-booms-for-dubai-real-estate/

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Todd Benjamin CNN International's Financial Editor Todd Benjamin and guest contributors get to grips with the issues affecting world business, and they want your questions and feedback.

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